Damn good idea B+!

I've got a tri top now (which was kind of pricey and I don't wear it apart from races, so I wouldn't rush out and buy one unless you're planning on doing a bit of racing), but that's a great piece of advice I'll certainly be passing on to mates just starting off in triathlon. It would certainly solves the following problem:


Thank god I'm not the only one who's had this frustration!

Rock doctor, in my first tri i was last swimmer and a lovely lifesaver paddled beside me encouraging me for the last couple of hundred metres (was a 750 m swim). I too am petrified of open water swimming, not re sharks or anything just a fear of drowning. This Sunday I am doing a shorter one, only 400m swim so hopefully I will be a bit braver, though I will still be last.

Reading this thread has been like trying to put down a good novel for me - somewhat impossible. I have been contemplating try-ing a tri for ages and I think after the last hour I've got all the inspiration i need!!

Contrary to what most people seem to find to begin with, it's actually the ride that freaks me out a bit (not to mention the transitions..) - as the only riding I've ever done has been with friends as a teenager on the old Repco MTB! I have a running and swimming background.... (hmm can't say I've hit the pool any time recently though..) - too busy pounding the pavement for the CC 1/2!

Anyhow must get my ass into gear and buy a bike ASAP. Danny, you've said enough - Newcastle Foreshore triathlon here I come.

surely you can find the one bike left in the compound without the aid of glasses?

Sounds like you're catching the bug!

Hey just borrow a bike from a mate and get into the Newcastle tri next weekend. You'll probably be hooked and front up to the bike shop the next day ready to give the credit card a punishing.

Don't worry too much about the bike leg either, when I arrive at the start of events I always look at all the people and think it's going to be way crowded, but with people coming out of the swim at all different times it's usually pretty spaced out on the bike course. Just stick to the left and go your own pace and let the big tough bike guys pass. You'll get em all back on the run!

The real answer is no. Wife (in courting, swooning days) use to direct me to my bike from outside compound. Like blind cricket. Now must have glasses or no can find bike

Thomo

Maaaate...just get prescription goggles !!

best thing I ever did...

I can second that. So much easier to see where you're going in the swim too.

--Toby

i know you love 'em....but do you really need to leave them on at the family barbie?

hi and thankyou all for the inspiration.

I have been a beginner runner for four years now. I will be fifty next year and have decided to have a go at a novice tri. I am an extremly poor swimmer. Why can I run 20k but am unable to breathe when I swim more than 30 metres????

Well hopped on the bike for the first time in 15 years. oops thats right must keep the balance!! What are gears??? But I manages 7k on the flat. and that was after running 7k hills and walking dogs for 40 mins...Now where are my bathers need to hit the pool

On a serious note where do I find a schedule for a beginner like me. I am fit do you think I could do the 300m/10k/3k in the next two weeks. Would love lots of advice even if you think I should slow down and make this a longer term goal. Although the tri season awaits and I'm not getting any younger....

Mr Horse

I am just always ready to race

a number belt holds my jocks up and I have elastic laces in my slippers !!

On this topic, where does one go for elastic laces?

I just got my elastics from a local sports store, I throw away the toggle part and tie the laces in a knot instead. Seeing as they are elastic you can just stretch and pull the shoes on.
Best things you could do in a tri for speed in transition are the elastic laces (with barefeet all the way in the short tris), get your feet in the bike shoes while you are riding (only took a couple of practices to get this right, it's not too hard, trust me!) and one outfit for the whole thing and this doesn't mean buying a swanky outfit. The first few years I just wore a pair of bathers with bike shorts (without a chamis thing, or only a small one like in tri shorts) and you get a cheapo tri suit Also, I use a race belt for my bib number and if you wear bike/tri shorts you can tuck the bib number into the back of your shorts while swimming to reduce drag or I put mine on when I get on the bike.

Also with open water swimming it is interesting to see the different styles. I've noticed some of the faster open water swimmers use choppy strokes (apparently it's good for keeping people out of your way!). Apparently it is also good in ocean swell to enter your arm into the water wider as this helps keep bouyancy. If you swim with your strokes closer in you tend to roll more.
I think it also takes awhile to get comfortable swimming in open water with people around. It's taken me about 10 races to start feeling comfortable in the water even though I can swim fine in the lap pool.

Re sighting while swimming: If you want to avoid dropping your body in the water when you sight, try to incorporate the look up with your stroke as much as possible. I tend to try to just glance during my breath. This works for me by turning my head sideways to breath then quickly turn my head forward just before I put my head back in the water. Some people do this every breath or others might only do it every 10 strokes or so. Other people might look before they breath. It's worth just practicing sighting in the pool and experimenting. It makes a huge difference to not losing momentum.

I got mine from running store Active Stride at Southbank.

Make sure you go for a couple of practices runs to get the tension right in them. Five minutes around the house at home will not be long enough.

I used them for the tri the other day and they were great - not having to fumble with laces is very good.

Hi and welcome to Coolrunning!
It might make it easier for us to tell you where events are if you tell us where you are!
I haven't competed in a tri as yet but I started swimming a few months ago. I was crap until i remembered how to breathe! After that I got better-I'm slow but I can swim 2km in the pool now. I'd probably sink in the open sea though. I'll try it one of these days.
300 metres isn't a huge swim-I see no reason why you shouldn't get out there and have a go. Thats the opinion of a semi beginner runner and a non triathlete so it probably doesn't count for alot! No doubt someone else will give you some better advice. All I can say is have fun and don't drown!

Easy peasy, you could dogpaddle or breaststroke 300m and you own't be far from shore so no worries about water depth. Being fit and a good runner you will have a strong finish - and then probably be totally hooked LOL

Give it a shot, what can you lose? Then report back!

curse the running forum that has a triathlon section

I have been thinking about getting back into triathlons, I was training for them around 99-02 but after a few injuries I never got back into them. I might have to join a club and get some swimming coaching again. I found them to be really satisfying when you finished.

Thanks for repies. I live in launceston unfortunatly the local pool is out of action, being turned into an aquatic center. I could join masters swimming group but that means another time commitment and I would prefer not to upset the very understanding husband. Best to do it when he's at work.

Alisonjc I am not a pretty good runner just a happy one who can plod for miles. I managed 300metre swim yesterday. foun the only wy to do it was to forget the breathing and not put head in water. probably looked pretty ugly but I felt ok.

will keep you informed of my progress.

PS just read the too much magnesium post. I am always in awe when I hear stories of adversities in sport. It is a strong mind and determinationthat gets some people through yet more inspiration from this site.

Thinkpink, I have been swimming for 2 weeks and managed ok in my first mini tri on the weekend that just passed. 150m swim, but really 100m after running in and out. The bike is easy as long as you leave enough in the legs to run the small distances. I found the 1500m run hard as I am not used to running after 5km hard on a bike. I finished the a HM in early October so the run should havebeen easy, but harder than I thought. Apparently you will get used to it. From my personal view, the longer you wait, the more regrets knowing you should have started sooner. I say go for it. Good luck either way

Mate, I hate open water swimming and freak out as easily as anyone. I did my first tri a couple of weeks ago (400/10/2) in very choppy and windy conditions ended up breaststroking most of it. But it didn't matter, the swim was over quickly enough being a short tri, and then being at the back of the field I got to do a lot of overtaking which always makes you feel like you must be going really fast.

I think you just have to remind yourself that if you're fit from running you can do it, the breathing difficulties etc are only psychological and can be managed by staying calm and not thrashing around in a panic.

A dolphin that hates open water swimming???

Probaly because of John West and Dean Lukin being out and about

Yep, I went for the irony. Isn't that how you picked Wombat? It won't fit your transformation into a smooth shaven triathlete otherwise!

We have another local tri this weekend. Every triathlete I know in this town responds when they hear I've entered either with "you're swimming...?" as if that is an obvious risk to the club's safety record, or with "don't worry, you'll catch a few on the run".

I'll show em... maybe

oops! let slip to the husband my plan for tri. He thinks I'm mad and would like time to increase life insurance before I do it. He goes to every running race with me and is very supportive but panics everytime I try something new!!! Partly upset that I may freeze in tasmanias icy water (wet suit stolen).

Dumb question - Do I buy cleats for mountain bike I read that you must have them?

NO no NO.

i know i bang on about this, and many disagree, but if it's a short tri, particularly mini tris, i think you are better off with standard pedals and do the bike and run legs in runners.
faster running through transitions, faster launch into the bike leg, faster dismount etc. (and i have won 3 out of the last 4 mini tris i have been in. DNFed the other with a flat. so don't tell me it doesn't work).
cleating yourself in is only worth a max of 2.5secs/km in short distance conditions to me. (timed on veledrome)

disadvantages: putting shoes on in T1, not looking like a pro...

but being on a MTB you won't look like a pro anyway, and if you were doing longer distance i would be going the whole new bike route, and yes cleats for longer distance.

quick ways for more speed on MTB. rider position and tyre choice. you can get some pretty skinny slicks onto MTB width rims and they make a phenomenal difference to speed.

I just bought new pedals for the old malvern star-alloy pedals with toe clips. cleats scare me!
I was in Rebel Sports yesterday and found myself looking at wetsuits-do they help at all or better just for cold weather?

Swimming in a wetsuit is an awesome experience! You literally don't do any work to keep yourself horizontal in the water and just glide along.

--Toby

Did any Coolrunners compete at Kurnell for TNSW Sydney Sprint Series race 1?

How did people go?

Wetsuits are a hard call - they can be bloody expensive for the use you're going to get out of them. However if you're not a strong swimmer they can make the whole swim leg a much more pleasant experience. Basically you don't need one, but if you're planning on doing quite a few races then it can be a nice thing to have.

Triathlon specific wetsuits have a lot of buoyancy in the legs so that, as Toby says, your body remains in a horizontal position without any effort on your behalf. Even if you don't kick at all, your legs won't sink! Therefore you ease up on the kicking and save your legs for the bike and run.

It will probably make you a little bit faster - although a wetsuit won't compensate for a poor stroke - but I think a big advantage is making you feel more comfortable swimming in open water as you won't get that sensation of sinking. And the main purpose of a tri wettie (even more so than warmth as most triathlons are in summer) is to ensure that you finish the swim leg fresher and having expended a lot less energy than if you'd swam without it.

The other bonus is that in deep water starts you don't even have to tread water while you're waiting for the start gun - you just bob up and down!

If you are considering one, check out the classifieds section of the Transitions forum or eBay for a deal on a second hand wetsuit, you'll save a fortune. Might be best to try a couple on in a sports store so you know your size.

I'm curious about just how buoyant a wettie makes you. From reading this and other threads you'd think it was like having water-wings strapped to your arms and legs - I'm imagining almost being on top of the water. Surely they don't make you that floaty???

initially it feels like paddling a canoe. in a longer swim you notice the small amount of trapped air become displaced and you aren't as floaty by the end, but even then it's still pretty good.

you may also notice that your feet are so high that they are breaking the surface of the water a whole lot more than usual

Hi Thomo,

Did the Kurnell Tri and it was great fun. I must admit that i prefer the ones put on by the Sri Chinmoy crowd as thy are usually way more relaxed. It could also be the fact that most of the Tri's we do are off road where the rides take hours as the hills are KILLERS!!! Black Mountain / Mt Stromlo need i say more.

Last off road Tri there was a grand total of 43 of us....there were more people in my wave that the total race in Canberra...

After reading Plazbots race report from Busso, Im thinking of adopting his technique of giving myself target heart rates for tris. But a bit confused as to how to chose an appropriate target.

Say for example (using me!) I was going to be doing a sprint tri - 750 / 20 / 5. And my avg hr for a straight 5k run is 181, would i use that as a target on the run do you think?? Or do you aim lower due to the compound effect of the swim/ride.

And then how do i assign a hr for the bike. I did a lactate threshold test ages ago on the turbo trainer and it gave me a hr of 150 (based on a 20min test). So would that be a suitable target?

And very rarely wear my monitor on the swim, so i dont have much data there.

Perhaps i should wear one for one race just to provide some background data. Ultimately Im interested in doing longer distances but have several sprint distance events in the coming months so figure it might be a good time to work this out.

Does anyone have any comments on this, or can point me towards some info.

Cheers

Hi psychicken
i'd ask the man himself (Plaz) about how he arrived at those targets but in general, the HR monitoring is helpful on the endurance events for ensuring pacing is spot on and you can maintain it the whole way. but it can be prone to variation from many factors on the day AND of course is a very personal thing - very hard to set off someone else's e.g. if i used Plaz's targets, i would last about 2k only then have to stop. i used it for the 2 marathons as a guide and had 137-139 as a max aim, as that is upper limit of aerobic thresehold for me. for half mara, 10k and less, i find it too limiting and prefer to just go for it.
for you, i reckon it would be limiting for the sprint tri's but good to collect the data for interest.
like you, i just want to go out and do everything Plaz just did - inspricational stuff
good luck!
PH

I don't know much/anything about sprint type heart rates. I would think that trying to hold a heart rate over a 20/5 bike run would be pretty hard as it takes about that long to settle into a rhythm for me on the bike alone. Usually, the max heart rate you will see for a race is the run from the swim to T1. Your effort will be well down if you pay attention to your heart rate trying to get it under control over a quick race. I think sprint is pretty much 'go hard and hold it'. Even over a half Ironman, I think it is possible to 'go hard and hold it'. Most of it is between the ears. It takes a few attempts to believe this though. Then again, my perception of going hard and a sprint specialist would be vastly different. Ironman is a different story and pacing is essential as you can't just limp out the last half hour like you can in a half if required.

oops just fell over this thread after starting a new one, sorry, very excited at doing first novice tri today

Thanks Peterhorse and Plazbot,

Really appreciate your replies.

And have to say, after todays experiment I totally agree with everything you both said. I just tried to race as norm today but kept an eye on my hr to see what it did. And, it varied significantly, although stabilised a tad towards the end of each leg. Once it stabilised i tried to keep it stable and it had the effect of me finishing thinking i could have gone way harder.

So lesson for the day - for sprint and OD, go hard and hold it!

Thanks again.

Well, I did my first open water swim this morning and despite being absolutely terrifying, I really enjoyed it. I don't think it helped that haven't swum in almost 6 weeks (being only a recent learner this kinda REALLY doesn't help). I also have a bit of an open water phobia and the one recurring nightmare I've had since childhood has been about tidal waves and being dragged out to sea

The water was cold but not too bad, I found that I went out way too fast and it was really hard to get my breathing into a nice rhythm - it was almost like I kept forgetting to breathe! I have a tendency to stick to the slow lane at the pool so that I've always got the side to grab on to if I get tired so that was a new fear for me to overcome. Still, at least now I know that I can just tread water when trying to recover a bit. It might sound a bit strange, but I felt a bit claustrophobic and looking down at the murk made me feel a bit panicky (well, a lot actually - the random fish shapes that I could barely make out didn't help, who knows what beasties were lurking down there???). Still, I kept plugging away and once I found some sort of groove, began to enjoy it. I didn't do too much, about 400m if that, but I found it really quite tiring. I suppose in a way it's like treadmill versus road running, pool versus open water. I actually found the sighting not too hard. I'm not sure what the correct technique is but I ended up taking my breath and then swinging my head forward before putting my face back in the water. Despite not being an overly strong swimmer, I was surprised the current didn't cause me any issues (being in the Bay may have made a big difference there?)

I felt really proud of myself afterwards and am looking forward to doing some more again this week. Only a 2k jog from home so will attempt to get there in the mornings before work a couple of times a week. At least I now know what my issues/limitations are and know what I need to work on. Thank goodness I learnt bilateral breathing in my lessons this year!!!

hi beki,
congrats on overcoming fears...
but here's another to potentially add... if the bay you refer to is port phillip bay then i wouldn't have been swimming in it today. it is filthy after rain. so much of melbourne's crap drains into it. (you should see what goes down the mordialloc creek and the patterson river which i live near).
i swim in it regularly but generally wait a couple of days after rain before swimming in it again, and prefer it if there's been a couple of days of strong sunlight as that is meant to kill some of the nasties.

re bilateral breathing.
it's good to have learnt it because sometimes you can only properly use one side if you get that little choppy stuff with the wind coming from one side. so it's good to be able to breathe every 4th stroke and to be able to do it on either side.

Congratulations Beki!!!

You will need to change your blog about this non swimmer business.

Triathlons coming up this year for you, no problems.

Rohan, Beki is in S Y D N E Y.

BTW This was sighted in Rohan's Bay the other day.

Just kidding. Lake Istapoka near Sebring, Fl. That has to be a huge gator to have a whole deer in its mouth.

Hi Rohan

Thanks for the tip - I'm in Sydney's Eastern 'burbs so no rain here for a few days - I know that the water quality is a tad bodgy for a few days after rain so will be picking my swim days very carefully

Lots of nice weather forecast for this week so hopefully plenty of opportunity to practice...

I can certainly see where the bilteral breathing will come in handy. Funny thing was that I normally find the left side harder to breathe on but felt more heaps more bouyant and was able to easily lift my face further out of the water to not get a mouthful. I can only imagine how good a wettie will be but that's a purchase I'm going to put off until as late as I can

*Edit* Thomo beat me to it - thanks mate

oh, .... flyover country.

i've seen it out the window as i fly up to queensland during the annual victorian winter exodus.

btw. used to live in florida. saw a lot of big fat gators... but none with a deer in their mouth!!
usually the encounter was when some dopey gator decided to sun itself on a road and you had to drive around it.

I had my first stack on the bike this morning - nothing spectacular...just incredibly embarrassing, I actually managed to fall off before I'd even got moving! I clipped in one side and for some reason (blaming it on my insomnia and incredibly tired state) I wa trying to clip in the other side before moving - dur. Ended up wobbling around for a few awful moments while waiting to hit the deck. Managed to land elbow and hip first on the concrete and lay there pathetically with my foot still stuck

I had to force myself to get on and continue as I was feeling like a bit of a sooky-lala. No real damage, just a nice big bruise on my hip and a scraped/bruised/stiff elbow. Called the ride quits early as my arm was getting really stiff. Ended up heading out for an open water swim instead which turned out to be beautiful. I was only planning on having a bit of a splash around, just a relax and improve my confidence. Didn't keep track of distance but ended up with what felt like a decent session. Perfect morning for it and really enjoyable, seem to have conquered my fear a bit but discovered something new and interesting - I actually felt kind of sea sick after a while!

Any tips for getting over this awful dizzy/sicky feeling from swimming in wobbly water or is it just a case of getting used to it with practice?

I had my first fall about a month ago and still have a nasty gash healing on my knee.
My bike faired far worse than I did unfortunately.

Re: open water swimming. I think it's a matter of practice and trying to get into your own rhythm without letting the choppy water dictate it for you. It's hard and I'm still learning.

A few months ago this thread was discussing goggles and what was the best brands etc. I thought I would give an update on what I have found succesful.

In summary, people in this thread and elsewhere recommended a lot of brands but the most votes were given to the following 4 models:

Speedo - speedsocket
Eyeline - bioform
TYR - technoflex 2.0
Aquaspere

I couldn't get a pair that fitted and was thinking I would have to settle to swimming with leaky googles. That was until I tried the TYR brand. They look cheap (and they are) but they have been absoultely perfect for me.

Just thought I would share my learnings and experiences with those who still haven't found a good pair. I suggest tying each of the above 4 brands first to find the perfect brand for you.

I found that the Speedo - speedsocket are a perfect fit for me. I bought a second pair today as I needed some that were tinted (another thing I hadn't thought of with swimming outdoors). They are a bit $$$ but for me have been well worth the expense

Sunset - I don't think my bike even touched the floor as it went up in the air with my legs

Shoulder and elbow are still a bit sore and it hurts to sit today but other than that it's all good

I'm pretty sad to be going back to work on Wednesday, I have enjoyed my morning swims so much - it's nice to lounge around in the sunshine afterwards and not to have to rush home and get ready for the office

I have been very inspired by all the posts here and have decided to also become a Tri-newbie. I'm thinking of doing the Jervis bay sprint course in Feb. Does anyone have any tips, in particluar the swim leg.?I have heard from the organisers that it will probably be wet-suit. Can anyone advise where I might get a triathlon type wet-suit in Sydney? Good luck to all for your 2008 tris-you are all very very inspring!

Hi Beki,

You're pretty amazing for only just having had your first fall. I pulled off something similar when I first started cycling....did a couple of wobbly circles before toppling over. It's embarassing but eventually you realise it's just a part of the fun Or maybe it's just me. I fear the more serious types of falls like flying over the handle bars. So far i've only toppled over in times like hill climbing when my chain popped off & I was pedalling nowhere. My coach told me not to go to the pub that night & tell people I had"stacked it". He assured me that wasn't a stack. Anyhow, the advice I was given in that situation is to always hang onto your handle bars & don't try to break your fall with your hands/arms. That's how you break collar bones etc.

It's interesting to hear about your dizziness in open water. I experienced a similar thing not long ago. I had to swim to shore as quick as I could. It was quite a hot day so I thought maybe it had something to do with that. It's a bit scary.

Greetings Tartanrunner

Welcome to CR and the wonderful world of triathlon!

On the recommendation of friends I bought my first wet suit from the Aqua Shop at Gordon.

They are the duck's pyjamas when it come to wet suits - hence they sell squillions of them. Chief fitter/seller Nicole is an accomplished triathlete herself. They often have a stand at events and she will help you get into your wetty before your race. Too good!

My advice on wet suits, if you have never swam in one before, is to get one sooner rather than later and practice, practice, practice. They can feel pretty freaky at first and take a bit of getting used to.

Our tri club will be at Huskisson in February - good luck! I am not sure if I will be racing though thanks to a little canyoning mishap.

Cheri

thanks so much wildthing for your excellent suggestion. You are one of the people whose adventures (!) I have been following for the past few months (including your blog). you have such determination & tenacity which is so inspiring for a novice like me-your tales of adventure (& misadventure!) are so entertaining-noty sure if that's your aim??? keep it up and all the best for acheiving your goals in 2008. I look forward to lots more reading!